Attention DirecTV Subscribers:
RFD formerly at the tail end of the DirecTV God Channels is now located at the start of the news cluster. The new location fronts CSPAN, DTV News Mix, NBC and FOX business and news channels.
Consider yourself notified…
Imus has been very complimentary regarding RFD production quality lately. Could this move to the news cluster be a precursor to RFD’s anticipated entry into AG news? Stay Tuned!
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Anybody notice today is the first anniversary of The Imus Times? Happy Birthday!
Yes, happy anniversary! & will I be able to do this tomorrow? computers & I do not a good marriage make…..
There will be Coffee 🙂
http://youhavetobethistalltogoonthisride.blogspot.com/2009/01/do-you-like-coffee.html
Classy guy that 41. Imus at his best! Even tried to cop some pain pills from Barbara. Pretty funny.
RFDTV has been better the past month or so. They’ve even picked up a few advertisers. Pest control stuff and electric wheel chairs but heck it’s a start I guess. Be interesting to see how it evolves.
Imus sounds better. Those drugs for his vocal chords seem to be helping. Hope it continues.
I have to agree with Skiwolf on the “41” interview this morning. Sounded as though the ol’ Iman was back and hitting his stride.
Gotta admire 41 Bush. I always did like him.
My favorite exchange this A.M. was Imus asking 41 if he was going to jump out of the plane again this year on his birthday…
…41 replies: (paraphrasing here) Yeah, you Bernie and I.
Great stuff.
Holy Crap!!!!
9:10 this a.m. Iman is throwing down the gauntlet on Rob and Karith. I don’t think he is playing…and maybe some changes are on the horizon….
9:15 and still on them…
…he is really going after Rob…
The Karith stuff has been building, Imus has been tough on her. Yesterday Imus turned off Karith’s microphone today as she was defending Doc Batisita’s kidney grubbing ex-wife…
Favorite moment 41 moment commenting on his “popularity” noted the number of people greet the former president by “shooting the bird”.
Former President George H W Bush, is commemorating the Nuclear aircraft carrier named after him today. He was on Imus in the Morning this morning.
http://youhavetobethistalltogoonthisride.blogspot.com/2009/01/free-falling-president-george-herbert.html
Ree, Great pic you have there of 41.
WTKK has posted the George H. Bush interview
Imus in the Morning guest: President George H. W. Bush 1/9/09
Imus in the Morning with President George H. W. Bush re; Aircraft Carrier being named after him, Barbara Bush health, President’s time in Military, meeting of all Presidents, President Clinton, time as head of CIA, sky diving, home in Maine, Presidential Library, Jim Nantz. Click|Here
Welcome back MsM aka msm22!
Donald, no doubt Rob is getting a bit old. Same stuff all the time and it’s losing it’s edge. Part of that is there just isn’t much funny stuff to talk about at the moment. Karith is just Karith. Not funny and more tedious by the day.
Whats missing? Larry Kenney! It’s time for Imus to help Karith land in a new position and bring back Larry!!!
larrykenney.net
good morning persons of interest…unfortunately or fortunately ?. too early for me to listen to Imus, so I cannot comment directly on content of new apparently pc’d version but I think from a satirical pt of view the crop is ripe for the picking on humor….in my opinion. Our economy is hanging on by a thread, nobody is demanding where all that dirty filthy lucre went & the working man’s party attempted to place the eye of the fiscal storm on the back of the working man, who I might pt out is their constituency…..we have a “new” admin. which is shaping up to be alot like a previous admin. (NAFTA/GATT) & I guess one could argue if the new boss is same as the old boss….we have large corps outsourcing, after going to capitol hill (gates) getting guest visas….I could continue but the irony of all this change is causing me to pi$$ my depends…..
Congratulations msm22 you found your way back!
I’m really sensitive to the collapse of the manufacturing economy having lived in NJ for my entire life and witnessing it first hand. NJ has long been a leader in wrong headed tax and spend policies which have chased manufacturing out of the state. Good NJ jobs have headed south and off-shore for years till finally there are very few manufacturing jobs left here.
Enough already, its time for a full review and frank assessment of the impact of NJ Government on businesses. Do a comparison between the southern states and NJ. Update laws and regulations and make NJ competitive again.
good to be back X! I believe it is time for a complete overhaul of the entire system, maybe not too complicated if we could elect some honest to God Constitutionalists, & maybe recognizet States Rights…..in my opinion, too many good paying jobs, have been outsourced period & our National manufacturing base has suffered in every state….the BS about American auto workers vs foreign was like a page out of the communist manifesto…..& from the little I’m hearing (trying to swear off the mews) looks like MORE gvn’t & less FREE enterprise…..CONSUMERS drive the economy & without a good paying job it is hard to be a GOOD CONSUMER……I would advocate raising import taxes too…
MsM,ChannelXRFR,
There is a geographical tipping point going on, remember after the Civil War and reconstruction, the South suffered. Now the Sunbelt is mounting a resurgence? Meanwhile it creates a “Rustbelt” up North. I do wonder if the politicos know their American History. There always needs to be a social relief valve. See Civil War. Printing up more money in my opinion will just build up the steam. I know when we were living in San Antonio, Toyota was building a plant.
Thanks ChannelX,
I am trying to figure out this blogging thing, my daughter and I looked at the different blog options, we tried to pick the easiest one for me to use, that’s why I went with Goggle. I still have to figure out this rss feed and stuff….baby steps 🙂
MsM, Check out: the most politically correct website. I love the People’s Cube.
http://youhavetobethistalltogoonthisride.blogspot.com/2009/01/peoples-cube-hillarious.html
The “creation” of the Rust Belt is hardly new news. This has been talked about for over 20 years.
Ree, in my opinion, todays politicos think they are bigger than history, hence it won’t repeat itsself….that being said, that plant in San Antonio, TEXANS built with state taxpayer $’s with most likely a tax deferred status of anywhere from 20 to 30 years….IFEAR is a great controller…..
MsM,
First of all…good to have you back. Your posts (along with Lou The Old Stooge) were some of my fave reads.
The insidious nature of the means to “outsource”, and the means to invite “transplants” (giving them huge “over the top” tax breaks and tax deferments) is repulsive. If the same considerations were given to the USA manufacturing base, and it was extended to them, for some people…that would smack of “socialism”. In fact…while trying to do just that with the big 3 American auto manufacturers just recently, it already invoked those very same charges.
A level playing field does not exist, and hasn’t for quite some time…going back during the decline of our steel manufacturers in the early 70’s…and the “dumping” of foreign steel from Japan that occurred.
Unfortunately, the point has now been rendered a moot one. American corporations (along with the working American people, and the very backbone of our financial system) are now reaping the effects of a lack of foresight.
An example of this is apparent from the geniuses that used computer models to fashion risky financial tools, and believing their computer models, that “risk” was virtually erased. They were (and so were the computer models) wrong.
They never considered the effect of the “what if scenario” that has befallen the entire world economy and that it could (and would) implode as it has. Fast money, cheap goods, lack of foresight (along with lack of oversight) and greed has brought the hellish scenario we are witnessing…and it will get worse. Very soon.
well, some of my pts, thru the whole Imus debacle were exactly the pts you are making Donald….I don’t believe in coincidence & I do believe everything is somehow related or interconnected….I still believe this whole fiscal crisis was “manufactured” to reward Wall St & spread fear throughout those responsible for paying for it all….the US TAXPAYER….I’ve stated it before & I’ll try again, ’cause I am a relatively tenacious old broad, when is enough, enough & the definition of insanity is trying the same thing over & over & then expecting different results….MY advocacy if for INDEPENDENTS to unite! I am swearing off MSM (except my buddy Lou Dobbs) & encouraging the GREAT AMERICAN DEBATE amongst ALL citizens…..in my opinion, the worst thing we could do right now is to give over to FEAR….
One last thing:
Due to the technological age we live in, and the flawed data used and was spread throughout the worlds finacial empires across the world, something should give us some pause to “re-think” a good many things.
Any computer genious knows this equation…and you don’t have to be ” Albert Einstein” or “Stephen Hawking” to figure it out:
“Sh*t in = Sh*t out”.
MsM,
“this whole fiscal crisis was “manufactured” to reward Wall St & spread fear throughout those responsible for paying for it all….the US TAXPAYER”
I can agree with a great deal of your suppositions…
however, I don’t agree with the above quote.
I think this mess was created (manufactured in your words) by stupid, arrogant and greedy people in many high sectors of the financial community.
That being said, yes…you are spot on about “who” will be left on the hook, and will suffer the most. Common American workers (taxpayers)…. along with many “common working people” all across the globe. That does not bode well for anyone’s security and well being.
not only was it manufactured by greedy elitist in the financial community, the payout plan was carried out by their corporate lackeys…the US CONGRESS & Donald I got at least a couple of billion more!
rhetorical ? Is HOTROD Blago the only elected public servant with dirty hands?
MsM,
“I got at least a couple of billion more!”
LOL…I hope those “billions” are in treasury notes or just “old fashioned” dollars. Be well, and keep your cards close to your vest.
🙂
Donald,
The point is over-taxation and over-regulation have driven manufacturers either out of business or off-shore. GM, Ford and Chrysler are proving to not be the bottomless pits politicians and labor leaders once relied on.
X, with the signing of NAFTA/GATT by the workingman’s party, Bill Clinton, in my opinion, UNIONS should have stopped making political endorsements & contributions….problem being the leadership of unions, is rather like that of our representation, the PROBLEM….
another rhetorical ? Is the rule of law being applied anywhere, anymore? OR are we just making sheit up as we go along?
This is spooky and really interesting:
http://www.flixxy.com/technology-and-education-2008.htm
Thanks Skiwolf,
I enjoyed that video, we are racing down the hyper highway.
No problem laree, glad you liked it. I just got tuned in to this flixxy thing by my brother who sent me the following.
All of you moms out there will love this one. It really is brilliant.
http://www.vimeo.com/1509073
This is for Donald – a big fan of outsourcing. 🙂
http://www.flixxy.com/offshore-outsourcing.htm
The rustbelt story is an old story. However with the US Govt now investing in and setting direction for the auto industry the average taxpaying citizen now has a stake in this. Maybe , just maybe congress should be looking at the legislative and regulatory roadblocks govt has put in the way of industry and revise those providing a cash free bailout.
Ski, Those are some awesome videos.
I too enjoyed those videos, thanks for sharing Skiwolf.
When I brought up the Rustbelt it was to highlight what was going on now in the Sunbelt, the trend- contrast. Remember when the big 3 came in front of Congress, their opposition came from the legislators with the auto companies in their states. The new thing is what is going on in the Sunbelt. I used Toyota building a plant in San Antonio as an example. Would there have been the same opposition to the big 3, before the build up of new auto plants in the South? Now the Rustbelt has competition and it isn’t up to competing? This reminds me of Jm Webb’s Book, Born Fighting, he mentions how many were left out of the economic boom times in Appalachia and Southern regions of the United State after reconstruction, post Civil War.
Old Trends and New Trends. That is one of the reasons, I like Skiwolf’s first video he posted. Technical training for folks to deal with issues, that have not even happened yet…being trained for the anticipation of issues. We are racing.
http://youhavetobethistalltogoonthisride.blogspot.com/2009/01/averaging-misery-index-economist-take.html
Hey Skiwolf…
Thanks for the video. It was funny as hell, and I laughed my arse off watching it.
…and yet…it really isn’t funny after all. Outsourcing, that is…not the video. 🙂
Chanx,
“The point is over-taxation and over-regulation have driven manufacturers either out of business or off-shore.”
Have you taken a look at the latest financial figures (including U.S. and global sales) for Toyota, Honda, Hyundia…(etc.) as of late?
Nobody is escaping this. Nobody.
” over-taxation and over-regulation ” played a part in reducing market shares for the US auto manufacturers over the last 20 years. Add lack of foresight, quality issues and innovation. That much I can agree with.
Giving foreign corporations an economic edge over our own companies: that I do not agree with. Your supposition that people in the southern states will work “cheaper” doing work comparative to what American auto workers are willing to make, tells me that if it is cheap, it is good. Less pay equals less revenue in the tax base, that leads and further acerbates the national, regional, and city wide problems of trying to meet basic services we all have come to expect…and depend on.
If earning less in our country is better for business…then Americans will have to settle for less services. You are talking about raising other countries life styles and financial bases…while lowering our own.
If Americans would like to see the income level per person rise in China (for instance) while ours declines, for the sake of “cheaper” products…ok. Just remember, it comes with a price…and many haven’t quite grasped at what that “price” will include.
Another thought:
When a Corporation goes public, and sells shares for supplemental investment income, that leads to another problem that has wreaked havoc upon us all: impatient and greedy investors.
Shareholders.
Shareholders that demand a higher than realistically expected return for more. In short: GREED.
The usual first demand? Usually, in the investors eyes, the Corporation needs to reduce workers wages and benefits, giving the investor more money. (Please note, Corporate executive salaries, bonuses and golden parachutes not in play here…)
No, this constant assault on the working middle American worker has grown exponentially throughout the last 30 years.
After the common workers? They (investors) still want more. Greed. It has become an endless cycle, and a downwards spiral, inviting the very same conditions that led the financial institutions to embark upon to “create wealth out of nothing” to satisfy the shareholders…which, in fact, brings us to what we are now presently dealing with.
There has to be an end to this cycle. Where will it end? How long will it take? Not much longer, I think. This is truly become a “reckoning” for many…and I am positive that many are not happy with the results.
Keeping on the subject of the Iman…
I am sure Imus is (and apparently was) content with a 1% return on his investments, while he was chided by so many “smart people” that thought he was nuts.
That says something to me about the Iman. He apparently “saw through the game”, and played it wisely.
DonaldInks,
When a Japanese auto maker came into Alabama proposing to build a new auto plant, one of the first things they did was look at the tax base. I can tell you, that we were paying 365.00 property tax, on a good size lot at least half an acre, and a three bedroom house. The Japanese company was looking at the tax base because they drew a correlation to the school system – they need educated workers. What is the tax rate in Chicago for example and what is their scholastic standing overall? Lee County, Alabama, this is an example of how they determine the pros and cons of selecting an area for auto plant. It doesn’t hurt that Auburn – Opelika’s sister town is where Auburn University is located.
http://www.opelika.org/Default.asp?ID=585&pg=Best+Auto+Plant+Site+Location
Donald, The US auto train left the station long ago. Americans have voted with their wallets and the US auto companies have lost. Now having lost in the marketplace the US auto companies and the UAW are at the public trough.
Politicians have stacked the deck against the US companies by over taxing and over regulating. Unions have won tremendous concessions from the auto companies which are proving to be unsustainable. Auto executives have totally subjugated themselves to the politicians and labor.
NJ for one refuses to accept the inevitable as companies such as GM and Ford leave and tax roles shrink the state steadily increases taxes regulations and costs.
“Now having lost in the marketplace the US auto companies and the UAW are at the public trough. ”
…and how are “foreign transplants” doing with THEIR sales today…here, and anywhere else?
Answer: they are crippled. Please notice THEIR governments are giving THEM financial assistance and they are at THEIR governments trough.
As I said, nobody is invulnerable at this stage of history.
NOBODY.
http://www.yomiuri.co.jp/dy/business/20090105TDY07302.htm
http://voices.kansascity.com/node/3008
This one is for Ree:
“When South Korean carmakers Hyundai staged a competition for a $1 billion plant, various states put together bids, but it was Alabama that won the contest in 2002 with a package worth $252 million.”
…and that is the TIP of a huge iceberg…
http://www.goodjobsfirst.org/corporate_subsidy/automobile_assembly_plants.cfm
Now, “who” is eating at the “public trough”?
“By the late 1990s there were signs that the big giveaway to BMW by South Carolina was exacerbating a fiscal crisis in the state. While the carmaker and other companies were enjoying minimal levels of corporate taxation, the state’s schools were falling into greater disrepair and educational achievement was worsening. Funds for other government services such as highway maintenance and public safety were also in short supply, leading to tax increases for families. “The foreign companies that come in here don’t care that the schools are terrible,” one philanthropist told a reporter. “They just want the cheap labor. And the incentives are so extraordinary.”
from the recent above link:
http://www.goodjobsfirst.org/corporate_subsidy/automobile_assembly_plants.cfm
DonaldInks,
One of the factors in our area was that the property tax wasn’t high enough- funds the school system, this worried the Japanese, who needed educated labor. They were looking at other sites. Are you saying the Southern States shouldn’t do their best to attract industry into their respective states, and put people to work?
It was once stated:
“There is no free lunch”.
In fact, there really are no “cheap” lunches either. There may be some “cheap” ones out there…but the indigestion is often quite painful. 😉
Ree,
“While the carmaker and other companies were enjoying minimal levels of corporate taxation, the state’s schools were falling into greater disrepair and educational achievement was worsening. Funds for other government services such as highway maintenance and public safety were also in short supply, leading to tax increases for families. “The foreign companies that come in here don’t care that the schools are terrible,” one philanthropist told a reporter. “They just want the cheap labor. And the incentives are so extraordinary.”
THAT was MY point. You want that? Go for it! 🙂
DonaldInks,
I am stating that the detraction to the Lee Co.,Alabama site was that the property tax, was looking too “Sparse” they looked at the tax rate as being too low for an educated workforce. They didn’t want to have to import labor. I am referring to where we were living in Alabama. I don’t know anything about the deals South Carolina, was making with foreign auto makers.
while everyone posting here is posting good factual arguments, I operate from memory….NAFTA/GATT was signed by bill clinton with the argument we needed to go GLOBAL & that thru going GLOBAL we would bring underdeveloped nations standards more on par with ours….NOT SO as we are seeing, our standards our being lowered to meet theirs….& yes this is ALL for the INVESTOR! to my knowledge EVERY foreign car plant built on US shores has NOT been funded with the parent companies monies but with TAXPAYERS dollars, the latest was (I believe, & once again memory only here people) VW somewhere in the south, at a “paltry” 5 1/2 mil to that states taxpayer with tax deferred subsidies for 20 to 30 years…..& I am willing to bet (cause I am a betting woman) the majority of the gov’s of these states will be in line for a FEDERAL handout…..in my opinion, one of the greatest AMERICAN lies sold to the “two partied” public was NAFTA/GATT….I want to know where the outrage is from the public regarding the mess both parties are culpable for…anyone who buys into MSM reporting of the inevitable finger pointing is less than naive, in my opinion, they are in denial & I got a finger for the corporate owned lackeys in charge of the publics trust….foreign companies build here, in my opinion, for OPPORTUNITY afforded to their shareholders, see above: US taxpayers paying for the construction of their plants with unGodly taxdeferred status, while US taxpayers make up the difference in their assessments being adjusted usually being raised….& at this pt I will not even mention the role the US Chamber of Commerce has played in this debacle of GREED…..
MsM,
The US Chamber of Commerce was highlighted when McCain/Kennedy Bill was proposed as U.S. immigration reform. Otherwise I don’t think they get reported on at all. They were making noise in Oklahoma’s unemployment rate is 4.7 Here is a link to break down by state and ranking. Oklahoma is #10
http://www.bls.gov/web/laumstrk.htm
I should have separated those two “They were making noise in Oklahoma”
Oklahoma’s unemployment rate is 4.7
Msm,
as per your quote:
“NAFTA/GATT was signed by bill clinton with the argument we needed to go GLOBAL & that thru going GLOBAL we would bring underdeveloped nations standards more on par with ours….NOT SO as we are seeing, our standards our being lowered to meet theirs.”
Exactly. That was one of my main points.
Thank You! 🙂
Ree,
http://www.goodjobsfirst.org/corporate_subsidy/automobile_assembly_plants.cfm
(from above link)
“In 1999 Alabama put together a $158 million subsidy deal to land a $400 million, 1.7 million-square-foot Honda plant. In 2002 state and local officials provided an additional package worth $90 million, including $33 million in tax breaks over 20 years, when Honda decided to expand the facility.”
These “”subsidies” = American tax money. Period.
Those 20 year “tax breaks” = a huge advantage to foreign transplants, loss of revenue to the State, and have to be made up in some fashion. The latest fashion? They are made up by increased taxes on the American worker. And, that is why they located, and chose the site.
No other reason.
Donald, you’re welcome & Amen…..NOW is the time, in my opinion, for us all to kiss off the alledged “bi-partisan” aspects of governing, ask pointed ?’s of our “representatives”, demand answers & solutions that benefit the working class of THIS country & expect NO LESS…..we need to have some relief in the form of campaign finance reform, guest worker visas, increasing import taxation, for the Pres elect to hold true to his campaign promise of lobbyist (ie US Commerce of Congress), as well as his promise to re-visit NAFTA/GATT. to name of few, which in my opinion, will provide decent living wage jobs for American citizens…….& furthermore, no longer must we buy into MSM opinions that parrot their corporate masters & in particular in that vein demand answers about CORPORATE WELFARE bailouts with NO ACCOUNTIBILITY & whose results thus far are NON EXISTANT…..
meant Commerce not Congress….
MsM,
There is no way to renegotiate NAFTA the only “Sane” action would be to do away with it. When Barack Obama, came out early in the campaign against NAFTA, he had my husband’s vote. Quote my husband, I would vote for him for that sole position. That position got watered down during the course of the campaign.
DonaldInks,
Why would anyone have to make up “Taxes” the infrastructure is already there. What Burden does the Auto Plant, existing in the community cause their local government to raise their taxes? Keeping up the roads to the facility? Loss of “revenue” to the Government – the Government isn’t a private entity set up to make a profit.
I changed my Gravatar but it still keeps coming up with the old one. I show up with my new one on Bella an Tygrrrrr Express’s blog, they are wordpress blogs also. Odd because I changed my Gravatar through my WordPress Account here. I would think the new Gravatar would show up here first.
Ben Stein’s Everybody’s Business is one of my favorite Sunday morning reads. This week he offers this observation regarding President Elect Barack Obama;
Note to Ski: Ben Stein is one of the reasons I have not totally cancelled my subscription to the NYT!
Ree, New gravatar has arrived, looking good. Apparently it takes time for the gravatar’s to make their way through the system.
Atlas Shrugged is back in the news again…
http://youhavetobethistalltogoonthisride.blogspot.com/2009/01/ayn-rand-atlas-shrugged-revisited.html
ChannelXRFR I did change it yesterday afternoon, I tried clicking update profile again, trying to goose the system 🙂
I am taking the rest of Sunday off but for Imus Fans, I posted an olden goldy. Please Ann Coulter let sleeping dogs lie…and if Coulter, really wanted to boost her book sales, why didn’t she go on Imus in the Morning. I mean, I don’t think Oprah has scheduled her, does this have something to do with this below?
http://youhavetobethistalltogoonthisride.blogspot.com/2009/01/ann-coulter-opens-up-old-wounds.html
X, I agree about Stein. There are maybe a few others. I also keep subscribing but mostly due to the stuff only the NY Times publishes. Science Times, Dinning Out, Travel, etc. If not for that I’d dump it.
Did have a funny email exchange with Harvey Araton. Back and forth three times in fact. He took exception to me calling him lazy for not keeping up with what Imus has been doing for the last year. It amused me that the guy wrote me back. Kind of funny.
Why is gas going up at the pump when oil is at 39.00 a barrel?
http://apnews.myway.com/article/20090112/D95LIUJ00.html
http://youhavetobethistalltogoonthisride.blogspot.com/2009/01/doris-kearns-goodwin-at-breakers.html
This is quite interesting for all you Political Science junkies like me.
What path do you think we are on?
http://www.flixxy.com/political-systems.htm
Skiwolf
The end of the video reminded me of what is going on in Oakland, California right now.
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,479364,00.html
ski, rhetorical ? right? & I wouldn’t necessarily isolate what’s happening to any one location in our country….like I’ve said before, fear & dependency are a great controllers…..
This one is for Stdomsgirl, the podcast for todays show isn’t up yet on 77WABC or WTKK.
http://youhavetobethistalltogoonthisride.blogspot.com/2009/01/why-do-irish-people-of-irish-descent.html
Donald, Was looking at goodjobsfirst which I would summarize as..
They author(s) present financial assistance as inherently evil and wrong, fait accompli. However, it occurred to me in reading the piece there’s some data missing such as; what makes up this “financial assistance” the author(s) are so adamantly opposed to?
In general the assistance includes: economic development tax credits, training assistance, and real and personal property tax abatements. States also provide infrastructure support such as highway and interstate access to the site, hiring and training of workers and creation of water and sewer improvements as well as improvements to air, rail, port and intermodal transport. It’s important to note these forms of financial assistance are not limited to the auto industry or the south east.
Proponents of economic funding argue tax credits and abatements recognize the low impact a manufacturing site has on the cost of services to government. They also argue infrastructure support for economic development is a proper role of government.
Is “financial assistance” inherently wrong? Like everything else its a matter of degree. Certainly there are financial consequences to governments in providing “financial assistance”. The right amount of assistance should be based on the business investment and the number of jobs created, in other words on the business case.
“goodjobsfirst” is a labor funded policy center which promotes a pro-union point of view. Found chicagofedblogs.org by Bill Testa of the Federal Reserve Bank of Chicago to provide a less biased more reasoned discussion on the topic.
Thanks Laree ~ 🙂
Your Welcome stdomsgirl 🙂
Chanx,
From your link:
“Even so, the “gold standard” by which public policies must be judged is whether the state could possibly do better. Opponents of tax incentives for business argue that, because of such tax breaks, critical public services such as education remain underfunded. In particular, public education suffers, contributing to sub-par income growth and exacerbating social problems such as crime, poor electoral participation, and poor public health. If we accept this view, the economic returns to the practice of competitive business tax incentives are not optimal; the economic returns from any short-term job and income gains to the local economy are less than the foregone returns that greater education spending would bring locally and nationally.
In rebuttal, one might argue that business taxes are not the only possible source of revenue for highly valued public services such as education. An ideal of government is one in which citizens understand both the value of public services provided and the real costs of these benefits and, subsequently, make their choices known at the ballot box.”
In his rebuttal opinion, he states (as above):
…”In rebuttal, one might argue that business taxes are not the only possible source of revenue for highly valued public services such as education.”
Who ever said that business was (or SHOULD be) the ONLY source of revenue as taxes (for just one example, public education, and other State needs to service the populous) ?
Just look at your own ” private citizen” property tax statement. The public (i.e. working person) is doing his “fair share”. Shifting these taxes down to an already lower wage earner and letting them foot the entire bill is wrongheaded, and will not elevate many out of poverty. They will merely have jobs…and subsist on what meager means they can…which is just above being pretty much “treading water”.
All that is now a moot point, because all auto manufacturers (foreign or domestic) are in deep doo-doo. Their (foreign) countries (with the lone exception of Sweden) are helping their home based manufacturers in these times with government subsidies and rescue packages. Now that the “transplants” in the south are hitting hard times…isn’t it convenient they will pay no taxes or be required to have made up the difference during the HARD times, yet reaped the blessings in the GOOD times?
That’s all I’m saying. 😉
One last thought for today….
This doesn’t apply to just “foreign transplants”, but tax breaks and subsidies in general for corporates. (corpirates, as I now refer to them. 😉
Consider what befell Minnesota and the many lucrative incentives given to Northwest Airlines through the past 15 years. (Yes, my former employer of 21 years, that contracted my entire sector to cheap labor).
This is but one link to many that you can Google for entertainment purposes…
http://hometownsource.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=4899&Itemid=71
This is, indeed, a beauty. Copirates at their best. Continuing from the above post on Minnesota and Northwest Airlines… what was ponied up by the State of Minnesota, and what Nothwest Airlines delivered:
http://www.leg.state.mn.us/LRL/Issues/Nwa.asp
Donald,
What would my property tax bill tell me? ” New Jersey through over taxation and regulation has been particularly effective at chasing industry out of the state resulting in ever increasing taxes.
Business taxes overall have a counter productive effect with either the consumer or the employee indirectly assuming the cost to this point Testa pointed out;
Of course businesses should pay taxes. However, those taxes need to set in a way that is not punitive to those businesses.
The auto industry has always been cyclical where in a free market system only the strong survive.
more good factual arguments, all I can say is, has it occured to anyone else, that politicos can make any set of excuses for any scenario & we should just buy it….except this go round we are going to be paying plenty….
NorthWest Airlines certainly puts the GM and Chrysler bailouts into perspective. Very similar situations as these companies are in industries that are capital and labor intensive with excess capacity and highly susceptible to swings in the oil industry.
GM and Chrysler are very sick companies. While there are a number of ideas out there on how to turn the situation around truth is most of these have been tried in one form or another. Improved quality, robotics, smaller cars, electric cars, reduced costs, competitive pricing, improved marketing, incentives etc have all been tried and have failed to cure the patient. The latest treatment is to put the companies in the domain of public interest. Problem is these companies are past the point where they can be repaired without a complete restructuring via bankruptcy, even this is not guaranteed!
Understanding the argument of a worldwide auto industry recession the fact remains that even in good times the industry is over capacity. However one of these companies needs to either fail or be consolidated. Question is; should the government or marketplace decide what happens? My trust is with the consumer, therefore I vote for the marketplace.
Look out Bart there is a massive tax increase coming your way….
Tax relief for ordinary Americans! Is this change you can believe in?
Chanx,
“Question is; should the government or marketplace decide what happens? My trust is with the consumer, therefore I vote for the marketplace.”
Right now, it doesn’t make any difference. The “marketplace” (the financier’s and banking systems) have obliterated most of the world “marketplaces”.
So, if all other world Governments give relief to their home based manufacturing sectors, your argument seems quite suicidal, at best.
New Thread ~ Imus does Hannity!
Case in point; Daimler pumped billions of $s into Chrysler to find out it is a bottom less pit. Cerberus followed Daimler and pumped billions more $s into Chrysler. Recently the auto company has received additional billions of $s from the US Government.
If one of the best run automakers in the world and one of the top turnaround companies cannot make Chrysler a viable business it is highly doubtful the US Government would yield a different result.
Chanx,
“Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results.”
Albert Einstein
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That quote is exemplified by the example of Americans voting year after year for either political party’s representation, and getting the same (and exponentially worse) result…isn’t it? LOL…
I give up.
Let’s just get rid of all Government…Federal, State and Local. Let’s privatize the whole thing to Wall Street and “free enterprise”.
But, while we are at it, let’s be sure to not get rid of the Federal Reserve (since they are not a part of the Federal Government…they are a private sector entity also)…and as Paulson has shown, there is “great wisdom there”…
Of course, we would all be much better off…including our National defense. All of our defense needs could be contracted out and outsourced and we would be in fine hands.
And, just think, no more taxes!
Supposedly, “there is no free lunch”…so someone will pay. Equally and fairly, I am sure. 😉
All the above was obviously over the top sarcasm, and I apologize now before the clicking the “Submit Comment” button. 🙂
My preference is for a government that adheres to the US Constitution. Maybe that is to simple to hope for…